Business Communicators of Second Life®

Meeting Transcript: Avatar Psychographics

Many thanks once again to Market Truths for giving us a preview into their just-released research, Psychographic Segments and Media Consumption.  President Mary Ellen Gordon (virtually, Pebbles Hannya) provided insights on exactly those two things, after months of rigorous research with Second Life avatars.

The report compares the SL population to the SL international population as well as to the general US population.  The research looks at the avatar media usage of twenty-five traditional and new media channels - as well as the personality characteristics of SL avatars, grouping them into 6 distinct psychographic categories:  Team Players, Entrepreneurs, Competitors, Connectors, Chameleons, and Apprehensives.  These are important principles to consider when implementing marketing and communications practices within SL and other similar virtual worlds.  I encourage you to read through the transcript to get a sense of these personas.  To delve deeper, you can purchase the report for $200 (US) here.

Rather than simply telling us about these personas, Mary Ellen introduced us to six prototypical avatars who each demonstrated the characteristics of their own psychographic segment.

If you are a student of some of the research about virtual world "players", perhaps one of the most important points to keep in mind as you delve into the transcript of the meeting below, is that this psychographics research focuses on the various personality types exhibited within SL - what they value and what their interests are.  This research differs from work done by for example, Nick Yee or game designer Richard Bartle, (today's Metanomics guest who among many things, discussed his MUD player-types) in that Bartle looks at the different categories of players  in terms of "what's fun" for them - and how they approach the multi-player game -  for the purpose of game design.  Market Truths studied avatars from the standpoint of personality types and what they value in a non-game virtual construct like Second Life in terms of marketing implications.

If you were unable to attend the SL Business Communicators meeting last Friday, the SL Marketers Club will be hosting Mary Ellen on March 17th, 12:00 p.m. SLT,  where she will be again discussing the results of the avatar psychographic study.  Contact Cybergrrl Oh in SL for more info on that meeting.

Meeting Transcript: March 7, 2008

Introduction

Znetlady: Welcome everyone.
Znetlady: As we get started, I'm asking that you IM questions to me - Znetlady.
Znetlady: We aren't normally so formal, but usually there are a ton of q's on this topic, so this way we can keep them organized.
Znetlady: We are using chat, not voice - primarily so we can capture a transcript for posting.
Alice Klinger: very good :-)
Znetlady: I will be posting it on the Business Communicators blog.
Znetlady: I think it helps everyone and avoids audio problems.
Znetlady: So, with that, I' like to say we are lucky to get the first view on the long awaited psychographics study of SL avatars.
Znetlady: Pebbles has been working on it for months, as a member of SLBC, she is kind enough to provide us this information.
Znetlady: She has lots to cover, and she brought some guests - welcome to them as well - to help illustrate the
Znetlady: segmentation she discovered.
Znetlady: Once more, please IM questions to me as you have them, and we'll cover them after Pebbles walks us through
Znetlady: the findings.
Znetlady: With that, Pebbles, president of Market Truths - I give you the floor.
Pebbles Hannya: Thanks Z
Pebbles Hannya: And thanks to everyone for coming today.

Research Report Background: Getting Behind the Speculation

Pebbles Hannya: As you know, we're here to discuss a report we've just released on psychographic segments and media consumption.
Pebbles Hannya: To start out, I just want to provide a bit of background to the report.
Pebbles Hannya: Ever since we've been involved with SL, we've heard speculation about the types of people who frequent virtual worlds like SL.
Pebbles Hannya: Everyone seems to have a theory; teenagers, geeks, social outcasts who can't make RL friends
Pebbles Hannya: My personal favourite, which came from a client, is: "employed people who live with their parents."
Ima Ideator: lol
Kara Janus: Yeah, right.
Znetlady: hahahah
Pebbles Hannya: For a long time we've been working on ways to measure psychographic characteristics for virtual world participants that will be robust across samples and also work with non virtual world samples.
Pebbles Hannya: For anyone who is not familiar with the term, psychographics refers to things such as values, interests and personality.
Pebbles Hannya: Psychographics are helpful for marketing purposes because demographic information (age, gender, etc.) is often not sufficient to explain who buys what and why.
Pebbles Hannya: So anyway, since October 2006 (which seems approximately like forever in SL time), we've been developing a system for classifying people into psychographic segments.
Pebbles Hannya: To do that we've used a combination of qualitative and quantitative techniques, and tested using data from a variety of different samples.
Pebbles Hannya: The report we just released describes the results of that segmentation process, and compares US SL participants to international SL participants and to the US general population in terms of their psychographics and media consumption.
Pebbles Hannya: It's based on data collected from 918 people (358 US SL, 260 Intl SL, 300 US GP) via a Web survey, and follow-up interviews with 30 of those (five of the most prototypical members of each of six segments).

Avatar Media Consumption

Pebbles Hannya: Obviously with the time available today, I can only scratch the surface of what's in the report, so what I plan to do is:
Pebbles Hannya: First give you an overview of how the media consumption of US SL participants compares to that of the US general population.
Pebbles Hannya: Then introduce you to the six segments and give you an idea of some of the ways in which they differ from one another.
Pebbles Hannya: And finally take questions.
Pebbles Hannya: Does that all sound OK?
iAlja Writer: great!
Tempest Hennesy: .-'`'-. APPLAUSE APPLAUSE .-'`'-.
Znetlady: we're with you, Pebbles.
Pebbles Hannya: :) Okay thanks.
Pebbles Hannya: So let's get into the discussion of media consumption.
Pebbles Hannya: Remember, what we're going to be looking at is the difference between US SL participants and members of the general US population.
Pebbles Hannya: In particular, I'm going to be taking about both the prevalence of consumption of a particular type of media within each group (what proportion of people use each type of media) and the volume of use (hours of use in the week before the survey).
Pebbles Hannya: Going from top to bottom in the boxes, the top row will show types of media that are used by a greater proportion of US SL participants than the US general population and the bottom row will show types of media that are used less by SL participants.
Pebbles Hannya: The right most boxes in each row will show the types of media that SL users spend more time using than members of the general population and the left most boxes of each row show types of media they spend less time using.
Pebbles Hannya: Note that usage time is only for people who use the particular form of media.
Pebbles Hannya: So let me start with the types of media that SL users use more of and spend more time using than members of the general US population. Any guesses?
IYan Writer: blogs
Znetlady: blog
Pebbles Hannya: Both right -- anyone else?
Austen Scanlan: facebook
Pebbles Hannya: That's an interesting one Austen -- we'll come back to that in just a minute...
Tempest Hennesy: Inworld streaming video.
Pebbles Hannya: For now, let's look at the things that a higher proportion of SL users use and that they use a higher volume of...
Allison Selene: p2p networks
Pebbles Hannya: Yes, Tempest got one of them...
Pebbles Hannya: Second Life (obviously), other virtual worlds, instant messaging, and streaming audio
Pebbles Hannya: Now for media for which usage is more prevalent among SL users, but volume of usage is the same as for the general public:
Pebbles Hannya: Streaming video, e-books, podcasts, writing own blog, reading others’ blogs, and commenting on others’ blogs.
Pebbles Hannya: Those may not be particularly surprising, but would you have expected this:
Pebbles Hannya: SL users are more likely to use social networking sites, but those who do spend less time doing so that members of the general population.
Pebbles Hannya: The fact that the whole top row is digital stuff is pretty expected, but that lower usage volume for social networking sites did come as a surprise to me.
Pebbles Hannya: I think there are two possible reasons, but I would be interested in hearing what the rest of you think when we get to Q&A...
Pebbles Hannya: ... one possibility is that they've been there, done that, and moved on....
Pebbles Hannya: ... another is that this is their main venue for social networking and the actual social networking sites are just a supplement.
aEoLuS Standard Monitor (Green) with Screensaver: Picture paused
Pebbles Hannya: Anyway, moving on for now...
aEoLuS Standard Monitor (Green) with Screensaver: Screensaver enabled
aEoLuS Standard Monitor (Green) with Screensaver: Picture paused
Pebbles Hannya: Sticking on the left hand side - the area where SL participants have a lower volume of use -  we see that they
Pebbles Hannya: Spend less time shopping and looking for product information on the Web.
Pebbles Hannya: /box 6005
Znetlady: that's really interesting...
Pebbles Hannya: And spend less time watching TV -- and are also less likely to watch TV at all.
Znetlady: 'cuz we're in sl!
Pebbles Hannya: :)
Pebbles Hannya: And what a lot of people told us in the interviews is that they don't miss TV :)
Pebbles Hannya: Usage of two other forms of traditional media:  reading print newspapers and magazines, is also less prevalent among SL participants than the general US population.
Pebbles Hannya: What's interesting - and you can read more about this and all of the other details in the report itself - is that the media consumption patterns of US SL participants are more similar to international SL participants than to the general US population.
Allison Selene nods
Pebbles Hannya: OK, so that's a quick overview of some of the key findings regarding media. Now I want to change gears to tell you a bit about the segments.

Psychographic Segments

Pebbles Hannya: To do that, I thought I would introduce you to a member of each segment.
Pebbles Hannya: Due to privacy considerations and a desire to represent the prototypical characteristics of each segment, the avatars you're about to meet are acting "in character" today.
Pebbles Hannya: The RL people operating them may not necessarily be part of the segments they are representing.
Pebbles Hannya: Everything they're about to say is based on the actual data pertaining to the segment they're representing.
Pebbles Hannya: They're going to introduce you to their individual segments and discuss what makes each one unique.
Pebbles Hannya: Let's start out with Vivia representing the Team Player segment. Come on up Vivia.
Vivia Straaf: Hi everyone! :)
Znetlady: Hi!

The Team Players

Vivia Straaf: As Pebbles mentioned, I'm representing the Team Player segment, and it's no coincidence that I'm female.
Vivia Straaf: Here in SL, Team Players are equally likely to be male or female, but in the US general population there are more women than men in our segment.
Vivia Straaf: As a group in the US general population, we Team Players are disproportionately likely to come from high income households.
Vivia Straaf: That might help explain why were also the most likely to use some of the forms of media that Pebbles just talked about.
Vivia Straaf: We're most likely to have used a mobile phone or other handheld device to send text messages and most likely to have watched TV on a handheld device.
Vivia Straaf: We're also most likely to have used social networking sites, read electronic versions of magazines, instant messaged, and used the Web for shopping and product information.
Vivia Straaf: We're most likely to have visited other virtual worlds besides SL, but even so on average those of us Team Players who live in the US haven't been in SL as long as people in other segments have.
Vivia Straaf: Well one thing I can tell you about my segment is that we Team Players are outgoing. We're the most extroverted of the segments - maybe that's why they had me go first.
Brander Heron: lol
Znetlady: here, here
Allison Selene: lol
Tempest Hennesy: ..giggle..
Vivia Straaf grins.
Vivia Straaf: We also love to connect with other people. We're interested in getting to know them and letting them get to know us. And whether they met us here in SL or in RL, they would be meeting the same person - we have a lot of friends that cross-over from one to the other.
Vivia Straaf: We tend to use SL to extend our RL interests.
Vivia Straaf: We're also problem solvers so one of the things we like to do with others in SL and in RL is work together on projects whether it's for work or just for fun.
Vivia Straaf: So that's a quick introduction to the Team Player segment. Now I want to turn things over to Takeshi who is going to tell you about the Entrepreneurs.
Austen Scanlan: I wonder if there is any correlation between "why" women are less likely to use TXT over VOIP?
Tempest Hennesy: .-'`'-. APPLAUSE APPLAUSE .-'`'-.
Takeshi Kiama: Thanks Vivia :)
Kara Janus: /applause

The Entrepreneurs

Takeshi Kiama: My Segment, the Entrepreneurs are like the Team Players in some respects.
Takeshi Kiama: In particular, we‚'re even more enthusiastic about problem solving.
Takeshi Kiama: We really love the challenge in trying to figure things out - whether that's figuring out how to make a business better or learning how to do things here in SL.
Takeshi Kiama: We're also fairly extroverted and interested in connecting with others.
Takeshi Kiama: For example...
Takeshi Kiama: We, along with Connectors who you will be hearing from soon, are more into blogging than any other segment.
Takeshi Kiama: We also spend more time than any other segment talking on mobile phones.
Tempest Hennesy: Hee.
Takeshi Kiama: A couple of things make us different from the Team Players though.
Takeshi Kiama: For one thing, we're much more competitive!
Takeshi Kiama: They may enjoy playing the game, but we like to win! :D
Znetlady: :-)
Takeshi Kiama: Another thing that makes us different is that we're much more elusive.
Takeshi Kiama: With them what you see is what you get, but we tend to keep people guessing.
Takeshi Kiama: We're the same people inside, but the way other people tend to perceive us varies depending on where we are and who we're with.
Takeshi Kiama: That combination of characteristics is very useful for gaming, which is something that a lot of us Entrepreneurs enjoy.
Takeshi Kiama: Unfortunately, another thing that makes us different from the Team Players is that at least among the US general population, we have lower household incomes than members of other segments do. :(
Takeshi Kiama: Part of that might be because we tend to be younger (at least among US SL participants).
Takeshi Kiama: Among the US general population, there are more men than women in our segment.
Takeshi Kiama: Now that you know a bit about Entrepreneurs, I'll turn things over to Firedragon Bellios to tell you about Competitors.
Tempest Hennesy: .-'`'-. APPLAUSE APPLAUSE .-'`'-.
Kara Janus: /clap
spacetraveler Russell: c
Firedragon Bellios: Thanks Tankeshi
Tempest Hennesy: .-'`'-. APPLAUSE APPLAUSE .-'`'-.

Competitors

Firedragon Bellios: Hi everyone :D
Allison Selene: hi
spacetraveler Russell: hi fire
Cube Republic: hi
Firedragon Bellios: I'm here representing the Competitors segment. We and the remaining four segments each have a dominant trait...
Firedragon Bellios: ...competitiveness.!!!
Znetlady: lol
Firedragon Bellios: The Entrepreneurs (you've just heard their version) may like to win...
Firedragon Bellios: but that's really the MAIN thing we care about!
Austen Scanlan: So you are hard core gamer vs the previous casual gamer?
Firedragon Bellios: lol...yeah:)))
Firedragon Bellios: but that's really the MAIN thing we care about!
Firedragon Bellios: wiining
Firedragon Bellios: Speaking of which... unlike the enterpreneurs, among the US general population our household incomes are *higher* than average...:D
Firedragon Bellios: Even so, we feel uncomfortable when other people have things that we don't, or when their stuff is better than ours.
Firedragon Bellios: That's one of the appeals of SL for us. We can have stuff that's not accessible to us in RL. Here we can have a great house, a great car, a great body (as you can see:D)
Firedragon Bellios: - whatever we want.
Firedragon Bellios: In RL, we're a bit less into technology than most of the other segments represented here today.
Firedragon Bellios: Listening to streaming audio, blogging and reading blogs are all less prevalent among us Competitors than among the other segments, as are using social networking sites, instant messaging, using the Web for shopping or getting product info, and talking on mobile phones.
Firedragon Bellios: Perhaps not surprisingly in light of that, it took us longer to get into SL than some of the other groups. We're still underrepresented here in SL compared to the overall US population, but not *as* underrepresented as we used to be.
Shava Suntzu wonders if this is the same segment that's into collecting the inaccessible paramours, too...;)
Firedragon Bellios: We're also more likely to be younger (compared to US SL participants in other segments and male (compared to members of the US general population in other segments).
Firedragon Bellios: So now I'll turn you over to a member of the segment that’s most over-represented in SL: The Connectors...Absinthe :)
Tempest Hennesy: .-'`'-. APPLAUSE APPLAUSE .-'`'-.

The Connectors

Absinthe Primrose: Thanks Firedragon and Good Afternoon Everyone!
Absinthe Primrose: As Firedragon mentioned, we Connectors are the most over-represented compared to the general US population, but that's changing. ...
Absinthe Primrose: We've been in SL the longest - more than a year on average- - but as different types of people have come into SL we're shrinking as a percentage of the SL population.
Austen Scanlan: Over-represented ...is that a bad thing?
Absinthe Primrose: smiles
Absinthe Primrose: We don't mind though :)
Absinthe Primrose: What we Connectors really love about SL is that in enables us to meet different types of people and get to know them, so the more they merrier, we say.
Absinthe Primrose: We're the least extroverted of the segments, so it's sometimes easier for us to meet people in SL than it is in RL.
Absinthe Primrose: We Connectors also like to express ourselves, and SL is great for that too.
Absinthe Primrose: In fact, some of us believe that SL enables us to be more our true or ideal selves than we can be in RL.
Absinthe Primrose: Many of us find that expressing ourselves and making connections here has really enhanced our real lives.
Absinthe Primrose: Among US SL participants, we’re a bit older than members of the other segments are on average.
Austen Scanlan: Ah, yes, we're getting serious now...the alter ego.
Absinthe Primrose: lol
Znetlady: ya..
Absinthe Primrose: Moving out of SL and thinking about our segment as part of the general US population, we have lower household incomes (again on average).
Absinthe Primrose: We're heavy users of some types of media though....
Absinthe Primrose: Blogging, watching streaming video, listening to podcasts and streaming audio...
Absinthe Primrose: and reading print versions of books are all highly prevalent among members of our segment compared to the others.
Absinthe Primrose: Well, That provides you with some background about us!
Tempest Hennesy: .-'`'-. APPLAUSE APPLAUSE .-'`'-.
Absinthe Primrose: I'll now turn you over to my colleague from the Chameleons segment, Kylie Balogh! Thanks!!!
Firedragon Bellios: yeah
Tempest Hennesy: .-'`'-. APPLAUSE APPLAUSE .-'`'-.

The Chameleons

Kylie Balogh: Thank you Absinthe...
Kylie Balogh: Hello everybody!
Kylie Balogh: I'm Kylie and I'm in the Chameleon segment.
Kylie Balogh: They call us "Chameleons" because we tend to be a bit elusive.
Kylie Balogh: Like real chameleons, we feel that we're the same all the time.
Kylie Balogh: Whether it's RL or SL, we always feel that we're the same person.
Kylie Balogh: But, we've been told that people perceive us differently depending on the situation.
Kylie Balogh: That's probably why we often feel so few people really know us.
Kylie Balogh: For me, and my fellow Chameleons, SL is a relaxing and enjoyable place to be.
Kylie Balogh: We can take a break from the roles we play with our family, at our job, with our friends and neighbors, etc.
Kylie Balogh: RL stress, worry and responsibility give way to SL fun and fantasy.
Kylie Balogh: SL allows us to explore parts of ourselves that are hidden, lacking or repressed in our RL roles.
Kylie Balogh: If you take a close look at the US population, you'll see that the vast majority of Chameleons are female.
Kylie Balogh: And. we have lower incomes as compared to members of other segments. . . . . . sniff. . . . :-(
Kylie Balogh: We're among the least likely of the segments to read newspapers, listen to podcasts, watch streaming videos, or watch TV on a handheld device.
Kylie Balogh: Like the Connectors, on average we Chameleons have been in SL longer than members of the other segments.
Kylie Balogh: That's it for me, thanks for listening.
Kylie Balogh: Now I would like turn the podium over to Alexa Trefoil.
Vivia Straaf: /clap
Kylie Balogh: Alexa represents the final segment....
Kylie Balogh: and no, it's not an endangered species.....
Kylie Balogh: it's The Apprehensives segment.
Tempest Hennesy: .-'`'-. APPLAUSE APPLAUSE .-'`'-.
Znetlady: :)
Tempest Hennesy: ..giggle..
Takeshi Kiama: xD
Absinthe Primrose: rawr!
Kara Janus: LOL

The Apprehensives

Alexa Trefoil: Hello Everyone!
Alexa Trefoil: I’m from the Apprehensive segment.
Alexa Trefoil: As you might have guessed, our distinguishing characteristic is our apprehensiveness.
Alexa Trefoil: We’re wary about what other people and organizations are up to.
Alexa Trefoil: We’re concerned about the environment.
Alexa Trefoil: We’re concerned about things big companies do or might do -- LL, for example ?.
Alexa Trefoil: We’re concerned about private information about us becoming public.
Alexa Trefoil: As you can imagine, all of that can get rather stressful, so what we like about SL is that it’s a great place to come to blow of steam and just be silly for a while and get away from all of those concerns.
Alexa Trefoil: To do that, some of us like to role play (not the serious or dramatic types – just the fun ones), but others just like to goof around here.
Alexa Trefoil: If we haven’t picked an avatar for roleplay or a whimsical one such as the one I’m wearing today, we often choose avatars that closely resemble our RL selves. Some of us feel most comfortable that way.
Alexa Trefoil: No, I don't really look like a panda in RL....
Takeshi Kiama: hehe
Tempest Hennesy: ..giggle..
Alexa Trefoil: In RL those of us who are in SL but live outside of the US are more likely than people in other segments to work part-time.
Alexa Trefoil: We're less likely than members of other segments to have watched TV on handheld devices or tried other virtual worlds.
Alexa Trefoil: Okay, well now that you know a little bit about each of the segments, I'll turn things back to Pebbles : )
Tempest Hennesy: .-'`'-. APPLAUSE APPLAUSE .-'`'-.

Some Partially Organized Q&A

Recruitment for Study

Pebbles Hannya: OK-- thanks to all of our segment members.
Tempest Hennesy: .-'`'-. APPLAUSE APPLAUSE .-'`'-.
Pebbles Hannya: I think Znetlady has been keeping track of questions, so maybe she can help me with the Q and A?
Znetlady: I have a couple
Znetlady: Shava Suntzu: Hi, ZI! I'd like to ask: How did people find the website to answer the survey? I find that most people in-world aren't even aware, for example, that there is in-world media. Many don't ever read the official LL blog (ergo shock over the gambling ban, for example). So how can a group that finds their web site be ensured to be typical?
Pebbles Hannya: OK, maybe we can take those and then open up for any others.
Pebbles Hannya: People don't need to find our Web site Shava.
Pebbles Hannya: We have a panel of SL residents who participate in research projects for us.
Pebbles Hannya: They've been recruited in a variety of ways ....
Shava Suntzu: How do you find them, or they find you?
Austen Scanlan: How can be sure of a self selected sample?
Pebbles Hannya: ... trying to reach into different parts of the overall SL population.
Pebbles Hannya: Of course, there are always some people who just don't want to participate in research....
Pebbles Hannya: ... but since that's true in RL to, it also applies to the RL sample to which we're comparing.
Pebbles Hannya: It's a combination of them finding us and us finding them.
Pebbles Hannya: Then they join our research panel and a subset of that panel is selected for any particular project like this one...
Pebbles Hannya: ... so that reduces self-selection bias to at least some degree.
Pebbles Hannya: Any other questions?

Entrepreneurs & Blogging versus Connectors & Extorversion

Znetlady: Brander Heron: drill down into connection between entrepreneurs & blogging and connectors being the least extroverted. Thanks! : )
Pebbles Hannya: Let's start with connectors...
Pebbles Hannya: They are really interested in expressing themselves and getting to know other people, but they are not that extroverted.
Pebbles Hannya: I didn't really get into the qualitative research we did for this, but in part of that we discovered that some of the most prototypical connectors have disabilities or illnesses that limit their ability to make connections in RL...
Pebbles Hannya: ... or they are stay at home moms so don't have a lot of opportunity to connect with adults.
Pebbles Hannya: So for them things like SL and blogging are ways to express themselves and connect with others.
Pebbles Hannya: Entrepreneurs are also interested in making connections (though not quite as much so), but they are more extroverted and have less of those limitations.

How Character Types Emerged

Austen Scanlan: Did the character types emerge from the data or did you try to fit the personalities into the research?
Pebbles Hannya: Character types emerged from a huge amount of data.
Pebbles Hannya: Iterating between qualitative and quantitiative data collection.
Beyers Sellers: ZNet, now may be the time for my Q :)
Pebbles Hannya: First we did a series of exploratory interviews trying to understand motivations for being in SL...
Cube Republic: do massivly populated online worlds themselves attract a unique individual...for example would you find these traits on world of warcraft?
Znetlady: Ya, Beyers...sorry.
Cube Republic: or do you think sl in unique
Pebbles Hannya: ... so we could make sure we covered any SL specific things in addition to general stuff that has been done in other forms of personality testing and psychographic research.
Pebbles Hannya: Then we used quantitative data from thousands of people in RL and SL samples to make sure we had measures that were robust across SL and RL samples and also across countries.
Austen Scanlan: Well, the view from the GDC crowd in San Fran is that SLers are idealists.
Kara Janus: GDC?
Pebbles Hannya: Then we did additional qualitative research to better understand the most prototypical members of each segment.
Shava Suntzu: game dev conference
Kara Janus: thx
Austen Scanlan: Game Developer's Conference sorry.

Are Traits Different in SL?

Znetlady: Pebbles, Beyers had asked... Beyers Sellers: The categorization you are using seems similar to Richard Bartle's model for identifying four types of gamers: achievers, explorers, killers and socializers. Did you use his framework at all? How do you see yours differing? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bartle_Test
Shava Suntzu: idealist == utopians? ;)
Shava Suntzu is a SEAK.
Pebbles Hannya: OK -- First Cube's question...
Beyers Sellers is a SEAK also
Pebbles Hannya: ... One of the things we're interested in looking at now that we have the process for measuring psychographics worked out is how they compare across vws and other media.
Pebbles Hannya: I would expect that different vws, multiplayer games, social networking sites, etc. would have different levels of appeal to different segments...
Pebbles Hannya: This sort of relates to Ima's point...
Pebbles Hannya: Builders were much more prevalent in some segments than in others...
Pebbles Hannya: ... and different types of builders in different segments.
Pebbles Hannya: For example, the Connector segment is over-represented in SL (compared to US GP), and Connectors were among the first people in SL.
Pebbles Hannya: They like to build for fun -- just to create beautiful things.
Cube Republic: yes well theres people who hang, and those who create. Building is an easier skill to learn than scripting, but then very good computer programmers are less likely to be in sl
Pebbles Hannya: Other segments also build, but in some cases that's more directed.
Pebbles Hannya: Sorry -- just reading back through the questions to catch up...
Znetlady: Beyers Sellers: So I would like to ask: can you get a bit more technical? Did you use factor analysis for that? What were the other factors that you considered but ended up rejecting?

Are SL people Idealists? Richard Bartle's Categories

Pebbles Hannya: ... to Austen's point about SL people being idealists...
Pebbles Hannya: ... I think part of the problem with the type of speculation I mentioned at the start is...
Pebbles Hannya: ... everyone has their own theories about why people are here...
Pebbles Hannya: ... but the six segments are quite different in their motivations...
Pebbles Hannya: ... so any one segment might be largely correct for one segment, but not for others.
Beyers Sellers: did anyone answer the question about Richard Bartle's analysis?
Pebbles Hannya: So for example, that idealist theory would apply more to Connectors than, for example, Team Players or Apprehensives
Beyers Sellers: I am having him on my Metanomics show on Monday, it would be nice to know :)
Pebbles Hannya: We drew on a number of different existing ways of classifying people (this is in response to Buyers point)...
Cube Republic: do these sl traits come across in these folks everyday lifes, or in some respects does sl offer the oppotunity to be 'role playing' even though the profits may be good
Pebbles Hannya: Those include VALS (Values Attitudes and LIfestyles) which are a common way of expressing psychographics in marketing circles....
Pebbles Hannya: Also things like Myers-Briggs and other ways of measuring personality....
Pebbles Hannya: And Hofstede's work on culture.
Beyers Sellers: yes, I am familiar with those
Pebbles Hannya: Because what we were trying to do is find something that worked not only for gamers, but for other people too...
Pebbles Hannya: ... and also would work across countries...
Pebbles Hannya: ... But having said that, yes there would be some overlap in terms of attitudes toward gaming.
jamesjl Zerbino: Boo!
Beyers Sellers: If I can follow up on the VALS....
jamesjl Zerbino: Boo!
Austen Scanlan: Curious. Did you just compare your thinking to what people put in their profiles or exclude from their profiles?
Beyers Sellers: they have a bunch of categories, like innovators/survivors/thinkers/achievers etc
Pebbles Hannya: OK -- still on Buyer's next point...

Segmentation Process

Pebbles Hannya: ... yes, we did use factor analysis. Basically the process was:
Beyers Sellers: but your categories are different
Pebbles Hannya: 1) Generate items from our own qualitative research here plus review of all of those existing perspectives I just mentioned.
Pebbles Hannya: Then factor analysis to identify characteristics (factors) and eliminate items that were not helpful.
Beyers Sellers: would you use your different categories regardless of whether you were looking at virtual world behavior or RL behavior? Or is ther something about VWs that makes you need to consider new categories?
Beyers Sellers: thanks, Pebbles
jamesjl Zerbino: Boo!
Pebbles Hannya: We ended up using seven factors.
Pebbles Hannya: We used those to cluster people (using a number of different clustering algorithms)....
Pebbles Hannya: ... then fine-tuned the cluster solutions with discriminant analysis.
Beyers Sellers: great, thanks!
Pebbles Hannya: And tested those discriminant functions across a variety of samples to make sure they were robust.
Pebbles Hannya: Then used those for the classifications you saw today.
Pebbles Hannya: To Austen's point about profiles: We did that for the people we did follow-up interviews with but not everyone. It would be interesting to look more closely at that in the future though.
Shava Suntzu: Have you looked at Nick Yee's work, for comparison?
Austen Scanlan: So what does this mean to marketers, journalists, supporters and naysayers?
Pebbles Hannya: To Buyer's question about the different categories: This system of measuring is robust across VWs and RL (a lot of our testing was aimed at finding out if that was possible)...
Pebbles Hannya: .... but what we would expect to see is that different segments are over- or under-represented in different places.
Beyers Sellers: so then you feel that your classificaiton is better than VALS (or else you could have used that, rather than creating your own, right?)
Pebbles Hannya: We saw that a bit today with the general forms of media, but I suspect it would also be true, if for example, you compared different multiplayer games to each other.
Pebbles Hannya: This type of research is used a lot with TV for example, and different psychographic segments are drawn to different shows.
Pebbles Hannya: Same with magazines.
Cube Republic: interesting at a design level the consumer is imagined and created

Digital Natives

Pebbles Hannya: Not sure which of Nick Yee's papers you mean Shava, but there are some problems with the one about "Being Digital"
Pebbles Hannya: Good question Austen!
Pebbles Hannya: We discuss this in the report in greater depth, but just some quick points for now...
Shava Suntzu: I was thinking in general about the whole work he has at Daedelus
Pebbles Hannya: 1) It's a mistake to lump everyone in virtual worlds into one big bucket.
Pebbles Hannya: We're here for different reasons and it's important to take that into account.
Pebbles Hannya: Both in terms of who is targeted here and how they are approached.
Shava Suntzu: daedalus*
Pebbles Hannya: For example, some segments integrate RL and SL more, which explains why there is variation in whether or not people object to marketing here in a general sense.
Pebbles Hannya: Also, one thing that comes up a lot is the idea of digital natives...
Pebbles Hannya: ... the idea that today's kids are so different....
Cube Republic: ?
Cube Republic: ah
Pebbles Hannya: ... but what I think is interesting is the data for the adults here now is very similar to kids in terms of use of digital media.
Pebbles Hannya: So in terms of thinking ahead to what the future of media will look like, the adult population here now offers an interesting preview.
Shava Suntzu is speculated to be one of the oldest digital natives by the Harvard project...:)
spacetraveler Russell: growing shared fluency
Cube Republic: chinese citizens hold online relationships in high esteem, as important as there 'real life' friends, yet in the west we tend to meet online relationships with suspicion
Cube Republic: this was from a survey i read
spacetraveler Russell: is the reason mktg history of media?
Znetlady: Pebbles, I think we should wrap, and those that want to can stay?
Pebbles Hannya: Hmmm -- I'm not sure I know exactly what you're referring to Shava -- can you IM me the reference and then I'll get back to you about it?
Pebbles Hannya: Yes, good idea Z.
Pebbles Hannya: I'll let you close
Shava Suntzu considers creator vs. consumer to be a basic psychographic delineator from her personal experience.
Cube Republic: i could add to this, when i started to play i would socialise but as i learnt to create my view of the 'game' changed and also my interaction with others
Znetlady: great...
Beyers Sellers: Thanks all, great talks! If anyone is interested in similar topics, check out httpL//metanomics.net. We have a voice show every Monday at 11am SLT.

A Wrap

Znetlady: Thanks everyone for coming. Pebbles will stay around for further discussion.
Ima Ideator: I agree with Cube..I've experiened that as well
Znetlady: I'll be posting the transcript.
Tempest Hennesy: .-'`'-. APPLAUSE APPLAUSE .-'`'-.
Cube Republic: its a question of time
iAlja Writer: thanks all, this was really interesting!
Znetlady: You are welcome to stay and discuss.
Cube Republic: it takes so long to make quality
Beyers Sellers: Thios week we have Richard Bartle, who co-designed the first online world, and has very strong views on virtual worlds (and is quite critical of Second Life, btw)
Znetlady: I would like to invite you all to give me suggestions on meetings you'd like to have - or to present your work to the group.
spacetraveler Russell: c
Znetlady: We're all interested in learning what each other is doing.
Cube Republic: keep a sense of mystery lol
Austen Scanlan: Thank you. Very informative....
Znetlady: Thank you Pebbles. Thank you Segments!!!
Vivia Straaf: Thanks for having us. :)
Cube Republic: it was very intersting thanks :)
Tempest Hennesy: .-'`'-. APPLAUSE APPLAUSE .-'`'-.
Austen Scanlan: The performances, the historical recreations...wonderful!
Beyers Sellers: w00t!
Maryrose Mariani: Thanks Pebbles. Excellent as always.
Beyers Sellers: I looooooove the panda avatar!
Alexa Trefoil: Thank you Beyers :)
Firedragon Bellios: we all love alexa :)))
Znetlady: Yay, Pebbles and Gang!!
Ima Ideator: Thanks Pebbles!!!

March 10, 2008

SL Business Communicators Meeting: SkyTran Transcript

Our meeting SL Business Communicators meeting last Friday with UCI professor Crista Lopes a.k.a. Diva Canto flew by - literally.  We got the chance to see the coolest rezzing process ever -and it was the SL prototype of the RL magnetic levitation transportation pod project, SkyTran.  Below Professor Lopes explains the project and how she is using SL to inform the RL engineers and planners.

We're aiming at organizing an upcoming meeting with Unimodal who is driving the RW transportation system in California.

Introduction
Diva Canto: I gave everyone a landmark for our workshop in the sky
Znetlady Isbell: Got it.
Diva Canto: we'll move there in a bit
Csven Concord: Gracias, Diva.
Brandon Catteneo: OK
IYan Writer: ty Diva
Znetlady Isbell: Diva, maybe I should introduce you? Should I do that while
we wait a moment?
Csven Concord: Speech! Speech!
Diva Canto: yes, you're the master of ceremony!
Znetlady Isbell: LOL!! Diva Canto is an associate professor at University of
Calif., Irvine.
Znetlady Isbell: She came to UCI via Xerox's PARC
Diva Canto: http://www.ics.uci.edu/~lopes
Znetlady Isbell: and she is the headmaster here at SkyTran, helping the RL
company Unimodal bring it to life in the RL.
Znetlady Isbell: She'll tell you more about that, AND..
Znetlady Isbell: she is the developer of the new SLBrowser SL search engine
Znetlady Isbell: which is both a HUD and a web-based google-ish SE.
Znetlady Isbell: I use it all the time - a fast way to locate things out of
world.
Znetlady Isbell: She's been written up in the the Orange County Register about
this project and she tells me it is getting a lot of attention.
Znetlady Isbell: Diva, what did I miss?
Diva Canto: that's right, lots of web publications picked that up
Diva Canto: oh, that's about right
Znetlady Isbell: She's a fast typist too. lol
Diva Canto: :-)
Diva Canto: ok, so let me talk first about skytran, ok?
Znetlady Isbell: Please!!

SkyTran Project
Diva Canto: this is a prototype of a PRT system that's being designed by a
company here in Irvine
Diva Canto: PRT = Personal Rapid Transit
Diva Canto: it's the kind of transportation system that we see in sci-fi
movies :-)
Csven Concord: Maglev?
Diva Canto: they have developed a magnetic levitation technology yjay yjey
believe will enable that to happen
Csven Concord: *shuts up
Diva Canto: :-)
Diva Canto: np ask questions, interrupt me
Diva Canto: anyway
Diva Canto: they are looking to deploy a small prototype, proof-of-concept,
somewhere in California
Diva Canto: within the next couple of years
Diva Canto: they needed some help with the control software
Csven Concord: Attractive or repulsive?
Diva Canto: what do you mean?
Diva Canto: maglev?
Csven Concord: Yes
Diva Canto: oh, I'm afraid I don't know enough about maglev technology
*lughs*
Csven Concord: Just curious.
IYan Writer: isn't it repulsive by definition? otherwise it'd stick to the
track
Csven Concord: No.
Diva Canto: you can ask them or check their web site
Diva Canto: anyway, we helped them on ghe control software
Diva Canto: that's not the low-level control, but the logic control of the
cars
Diva Canto: -- when cars start and stop moving, their velocities, etc
Diva Canto: background --
Diva Canto: real-world systems have two or more levels of control
Diva Canto: the lowest one is very close to the physics of the system
Diva Canto: so, making sure thaty when the upper layers says "go at 100 mph"
it stays at 100mph
Diva Canto: stuff like that.
Diva Canto: but above that there are more layers of control
Diva Canto: so, we ignored the low level layers -- because SL's physics
sucks
Brandon Catteneo chuckles
Diva Canto: we made some emulations of the low level behavior, and proceeded
to study the higher-level logic
Diva Canto: the controller here controls the scheduling of the cars
Diva Canto: plus we did, as you see, 3D modeling of their system.
Diva Canto: this is actually very accurate, it was dsone according to their
specs
Diva Canto: and during the process, we found several bugs in their design,
which they promptly corrected
Bruce Voight: can you descrie, if any, safety features that are or will be
installded.
Diva Canto: oh there's all sorts of safety controls. we haven't simulated
those yet
Diva Canto: what you see here is just the beginning -- the scheduling --
making sure that the cars don't collide
Diva Canto: with each other, that is
Diva Canto: the engineers at Unimodal think this has been a super-valuable
tool for them
Bruce Voight: and also earthquake and power outtage features I assume.
Diva Canto: oh yes, lots and lots and lots of safety issue here!

Control System: The Guideway Brain
Csven Concord: Could you explain the control system a bit?
Diva Canto: safety will basically account for most of the code
Diva Canto: hmm, I'm afraid I can't go into the details of their control
Diva Canto: that's been NDA'ed
Csven Concord: So, if I were to ask if there are any levels of autonomy, you
couldn't answer - ?
Diva Canto: I can answer that.
Bruce Voight: will the controls be controlled by the driver or a master
steersman.....Like a rollercoaster?
Diva Canto: the autonomy is in each station controller
Diva Canto: the cars are relatively dumb
Csven Concord: ok
Diva Canto: I measn "passive" -- that's a better term :-)
Diva Canto: the guideway is the "brain" in a way
Diva Canto: it's also the guideway that makes the cars move
Diva Canto: that's part of their maglev technology
Diva Canto: so the staion controller sends signals to the guideway bricks
Diva Canto: if you zoom in, you'll see that the guideway is made of small
bricks
Csven Concord: Did you emulate it in SL?
Diva Canto: there's over 500 of them
Csven Concord: I mean, code-wise.
Diva Canto: yes -- everything
Diva Canto: there's a lot of "talking" between the bricks and the controller
Brandon Catteneo: So those are all scripted to align to each other?
Csven Concord: So each brick is "sensing" the train.
Diva Canto: yes. I wanted to show you the rez of the guideway, cos that's
really cool to see
Diva Canto: but this guideway down here is not responding to my commands --
my studemts must have messed it up yesterday
Diva Canto: let's go to our worlshop, shall we?
Diva Canto: it's it on the clouds.
Diva Canto: I gave most of you the landmark
Diva Canto: for the others, please pull up the map, notice a platform on the
upper left corner of this sim, and TO there
Diva Canto: or fly -- if you have a device that allows you to fly above the
clouds

To the SkyTran Workshop in the Sky
Bruce Voight: OK....The TP is too close...Have to TP somewhere else and then
to your shop.
Pebbles Hannya: It won't let me TP to the landmark.
Brandon Catteneo: I have the LM I can give it to whomever needs it
Csven Concord: fyi, @IYan, an "attractive" system has a T-shaped rail.
Magnets are under the "t" arms, and the attraction raises the vehvicle above
the top of the "T"
IYan Writer: ty csven, checked it out on wikipedia in the mean time :)
Csven Concord: Kind of a wrap-around.
Csven Concord: Ah. That'll work.
IYan Writer: but thanks :)
Csven Concord: I'd originally planned to get into maglev design after the
military.
RezTrackV29: Resetting Bricks
RezTrackV29: Resetting Virtual Points
Csven Concord: Not much in the U.S> unfortunately.
Diva Canto: ok, I made the whole thing disappear :-)
Diva Canto: Let me try to pull those other people up before I show the demo
Diva Canto: oh, try not to click on the objects!! :-)
Rissa Maidstone: / I'm sorry I got here late, this may have been covered. Is
this a project for CalTrans?
Diva Canto: this is an active workspace, you'll probably mess things up :-)
Znetlady Isbell: Hi, Rissa!
Diva Canto: no, not caltrans. This is Unimodal Inc. -- SkyTran
Brandon Catteneo: Just looking at the properties
Rissa Maidstone: Hi Znetlady :)
Brandon Catteneo: But thanks for telling me
Znetlady Isbell: I think it's what you are looking for Rissa!
Diva Canto: Anyway
Rissa Maidstone: Unimodal must be planning on "selling" this to
someone--it's a huge initiative.
Diva Canto: there's still one person down.
Rissa Maidstone: Me too Znetlady
Znetlady Isbell: Let me see if I can go help. Please go ahead Diva
Diva Canto: ok, I'll rez the track
Diva Canto: Is the machinima person here?
Diva Canto: Hi John and Rissa, aren't you guys from the Dr. Dobbs events?
John Zhaoying: Yup.
Rissa Maidstone grins.
Diva Canto: I thought I knew you
Rissa Maidstone: Part of what we do
John Zhaoying: How are you, Diva?
Diva Canto: Linda, are you here?
Pebbles Hannya: I think she went to try to find the missing person.
Diva Canto: ok, I'll wait a bit for her, cos the rezzing of the track is
really cool to see
Diva Canto: any questions?
Diva Canto: oh there she is
Znetlady Isbell: I think we have everyone.
Diva Canto: ok. zoom out everyone!

Rezzing and Riding SkyTran
Csven Concord: Do the track elements receive speed info and relay propulsive
commands to the vehicle?
Pebbles Hannya: Is there some sort of emergency button in the cars? For example, what
if someone is in one and it's already set to go somewhere and they have a
heart attack?
Diva Canto: I'll answer all of those questions in a bit. Let me create the
system
Diva Canto: look now!
Diva Canto: zoom out
IYan Writer: cool!
Diva Canto: really out
Post Wylie: neat indeed!
Diva Canto: the engineers wish they could do this in real life :-)
Rissa Maidstone chuckles.
Pebbles Hannya: Even in SL it's a neat trick!
Post Wylie: wont be too long....
Diva Canto: so, these bricks -- their size, position, rotation -- are made
according to the specs
Csven Concord: Imported track geometry data?
Diva Canto: "import" is a strong word :-)
Csven Concord: Granted.
Diva Canto: it was done manually
Diva Canto: the guideway has sections
John Zhaoying: Neat rez process.
Diva Canto: we were able to codify each section into an algorithm
John Zhaoying: Do the tracks form based on a call signal from the red
spheres?
Diva Canto: there ar ethe vehicles
Diva Canto: and some decoration
Diva Canto: now three of you can ride
Diva Canto: one at a time
Diva Canto: anyone wants to sit on the first car?
Central Station v87: clock start
Central Station v87 shouts: Station Assigned logical vp: 20
Central Station v87 shouts: Station Assigned physical vp: 20
Vehicle_1 shouts: Bogey got LVP: 20    brick calc starting pos:  <67.99619,
238.45389, 260.97198>
Diva Canto: yuo can only ride to the car in front
Diva Canto: you have to wait
Vehicle_1 shouts: starting pos: <65.85220, 238.43889, 260.97198>
Diva Canto: off he goes!
Diva Canto: second person?
Brandon Catteneo: lol
IYan Writer: let's see if he comes back safely first ;)
Brandon Catteneo: I was unsuccessful at that
Diva Canto: lol
Rissa Maidstone: laugh!
Diva Canto: just sit on the first car
Znetlady Isbell: anyone?
Diva Canto: I can send it off empty too
Central Station v87 shouts: Station Assigned logical vp: 4
Central Station v87 shouts: Station Assigned physical vp: 4
Vehicle_1 shouts: Bogey got LVP: 4    brick calc starting pos:  <67.99599,
238.45399, 260.97198>
Vehicle_1 shouts: Be Patient, bogey is waiting to start
Vehicle_1 shouts: starting pos: <65.85200, 238.43900, 260.97198>
John Zhaoying shouts: Hey! I can see my house from here!
Diva Canto: you can't sit on the car unless it's in the front of the line
Znetlady Isbell: lol
Rissa Maidstone: laugh!
Pebbles Hannya: In RL will there be one single route, or will cars branch off to go
different places?
Brandon Catteneo: maybe its my AO
Central Station v87 shouts: Station Assigned logical vp: 16
Central Station v87 shouts: Station Assigned physical vp: 16
Vehicle_1 shouts: Bogey got LVP: 16    brick calc starting pos:  <67.99599,
238.45399, 260.97198>
Vehicle_1 shouts: Be Patient, bogey is waiting to start
Diva Canto: in real life there are two phases for this project
Vehicle_1 shouts: starting pos: <65.85200, 238.43900, 260.97198>
Rissa Maidstone: The red and black balls are acting as a traffic
control/signal system?
Diva Canto: Rissa: yes. it's a visualization of our control system
Rissa Maidstone: Great.
Diva Canto: so they want to build a prototype first
Rissa Maidstone: You work for Unimodal Diva?
Znetlady Isbell: No, Rissa UCI
Diva Canto: the first prototypes will be exactly like this
Rissa Maidstone: Ok
QueueManager v10 shouts: vehicles_id:
QueueManager v10 shouts: curVehiclesInQueue: 0
QueueManager v10 shouts: last in queue vehicle id: 0
Znetlady Isbell: Professor Crista Lopes
Diva Canto: one single loop, one single statin
Diva Canto: but the idea is that there will be branches and lots of stations
Diva Canto: that's where the fun starts, fromthe control perspective
Central Station v87 shouts: Station freeing logical vp: 20
Rissa Maidstone: What is the advantage/cost compared to existing light rail?
Diva Canto: welcome back John
John Zhaoying: Wow, neat.
John Zhaoying: I hadn't realized I'd been unseated.
QueueManager v10 shouts: vehicles_id: 0
QueueManager v10 shouts: curVehiclesInQueue: 1
QueueManager v10 shouts: last in queue vehicle id: 0
Csven Concord: Frictionless
Diva Canto: you'll have to ask that to the Unimodal people, and people who
are into PRT. But from what OI understand
Pebbles Hannya: So the person would stay in a single car for their whole journey rather
than having to change to a different track at a station like on a subway?
Rissa Maidstone chuckles at John.
Diva Canto: yes -- this is a point-to-point system
Diva Canto: no need to go in bluks of people
Brander Heron: ETA for a working prototype?
Central Station v87 shouts: Station freeing logical vp: 4
Diva Canto: theoretically this is a lot more efficiently
Brandon Catteneo: This must've been dirt cheap for them.
IYan Writer: very cool!
QueueManager v10 shouts: vehicles_id: 0, 2
QueueManager v10 shouts: curVehiclesInQueue: 2
QueueManager v10 shouts: last in queue vehicle id: 2
Diva Canto: ETA: according to Unimodal, 2 years
John Zhaoying: Is there something about the track construction or other
details that doesn't make point-to-point incredibly wasteful of resources?
IYan Writer: /ao on
Diva Canto: I guess it's their maglev technology
Rissa Maidstone: Frictionless--smoother ride, lower maintenance costs, lower
energy usage?
Diva Canto: they say they can do it relatively cheap
Central Station v87 shouts: Station freeing logical vp: 16
John Zhaoying: Well, that's the engine. But you can do maglev for 'subways'
too. I'm talking about the logic of providing a capsule per person, vs. a
capsule for many people.
Csven Concord: I'd expect maintenance to be higher initially; new tech is
usually full of surprises.
Diva Canto: to give you some context -- I'm not a magle or PRT expert. I
think it would be great if we could hav ethe Unimodal people here too, so
they could answer those questions better than me
Brandon Catteneo: I mean this mock-up, doing it in SL, must've saved them a
good deal of money.

Design Problems Identified Through Simulation
John Zhaoying: Absolutely. Plus, with more moving parts, you have way more
points of failure.
Csven Concord: Tho the Japanese and Germans have been working on it for
quite a while now.
Diva Canto: yes that was the point of the simulation
Diva Canto: they were able to detect some design problems
Rissa Maidstone: Could you give an example?
John Zhaoying: i.e., the intelligence in each car, here, is equivalent to
the intelligence required to drive a whole subway train. So you have a point
of failure per person.
Diva Canto: and we're able to show this to a wide audience -- press, VCs,
potential partners
Csven Concord: Diva, are you moving this to Havok 4 anytime soon?
John Zhaoying: Whereas on a subway train, you take extra processors and
cheaply provide redundancy to your limited points of failure.
Diva Canto: no, not anytime soon. I want to focus on the high-level control
first
Diva Canto: physics is another whole thing
Diva Canto: there's another group
Diva Canto: in another UC campus that may do that part
Rissa Maidstone: Are they planning on carrying more than 1 person per "car"?
Diva Canto: I think it's a 2-people car
Rissa Maidstone: And back to design flaws, can you be more specific on
how/what was discovered?
IYan Writer: if you want to go "backwards", do you have to traverse almost
whole of the track? ie, is it one-way?
Diva Canto: @rissa, let me answer that
Rissa Maidstone grins.
Diva Canto: first, we found problems with their calculations of the
positions and rotations of the bricks
Diva Canto: so they fixed that
John Zhaoying: iYan -- yeah, that's interesting. A system without
T-junctions would compel a lot of backtracking. But can you do a T-junction
in maglev?
Diva Canto: then we found a serious design problem with the station
Diva Canto: on their first design, they had the upper track right on top of
the lower track at the station/
Diva Canto: in their concept drawings it looked good. let me get you a
picture
Rissa Maidstone: Great and this is next queston since I already typed it :)
Interesting--and this was all brought in from AutoCadd? or how was the
conversion to SL performed?
John Zhaoying: So you guys came in and fixed an SL design-in-progress, then?
Diva Canto: but when we made it here and looked at it in this immersive
manner, it didn't look so good
Diva Canto: it looked quite unsafe to me
Diva Canto: so I told them, brought them here, and they agreed that it was a
bad idea
IYan Writer: RL design, john
Rissa Maidstone: Makes a big difference to be able to "see" the conceptual
design.
Diva Canto: they went back to the drawing table and produced this other
layout
Diva Canto: where the station if horizontally offset
Csven Concord: What tools *are* they using?
Diva Canto: there was yet another design problem
Diva Canto: when they rode the car and used the mouselook view
Diva Canto: they realized that they had to be very carefull with the roof of
the car
Diva Canto: it must cover the sight of the track above
Diva Canto: because people prone to eppileptic attacks may have one :-)
Rissa Maidstone: Are you doing noise simulaton too?
John Zhaoying: Because they're seeing a rapidly-flickering pattern?
Rissa Maidstone: That's got to be part of the concern with this type of
infrastructure.
Diva Canto: no, no noise simulation
Diva Canto: @john - yes
John Zhaoying: Maglev is very quiet
Diva Canto: here: http://www.unimodal.com/
John Zhaoying: It's levitative, so no friction to produce noise.
Diva Canto: that's how their original concept was
Rissa Maidstone: I'm sure, but it's likely it went through some kind of
"hush house" or noise simulation in order to become very quiet.
Diva Canto: they changed it to pull the station out
John Zhaoying: No, it's just that when there's no contact between any
physical component, there's no noise.
Csven Concord: There are no "touching" elements.
Diva Canto: right. you know what? maybe Linda can invite the SkyTran people
here one day
Diva Canto: PRT is really interesting in itself
Diva Canto: and their technology too, obviously
Rissa Maidstone: Yes, and I'd love to talk to them if they come in.
John Zhaoying: Your worry in systems like this is EMF. The Gauss on maglev
magnets is huge, and you have all sorts of power going to maintain flux.
Rissa Maidstone: Agreed
Diva Canto: yeah, there are all kinds of problems. They think they have good
solutions for them
John Zhaoying: Component hum might be - almost certainly is - an issue if
there's anything conductive in the tracks besides the magnet coilbars.
Diva Canto: anyway, we're focusing here on the logic control and failures at
that leve;
Diva Canto: this has been quite useful for everyone
Rissa Maidstone: I'm only asking these questions because it's interesting to
see how a project like this is incepted here and how far you can take it to
simulate
John Zhaoying: So what's the logic architecture, Diva?
Pebbles Hannya: Speaking of that, will you do the next stage of simulation here too --
where different people want to go different places?
John Zhaoying: All asynchronous state machines talking to each other?
Diva Canto: the part that controls the scheduling of the cars and their
speed at any point of the track
Csven Concord: You could simulate the noise. Each brick could trigger a
sound event as it was propelling the vehicle.
John Zhaoying: Is it controlled deterministically from toplevel?
Diva Canto: I'm afraid I can't go into details, I'm NDA-ed on that
Rissa Maidstone: Understood :)
John Zhaoying: Or are the cars smart enough to figure out the world on their
own?
Diva Canto: no the cars are relatively passive in this system
Diva Canto: the stations are the brains
Diva Canto: the stations "talk" to the guideway bricks
John Zhaoying: Oh, interesting.
Diva Canto: and the bricks are the ones that make the cars move, slow down,
speed up, etc
John Zhaoying: So it's like routers talking to each other about
packets-in-transit on an out-of-band connection. MPLS for concrete and
steel.
Diva Canto: "routers" is a great keyword!
Diva Canto: this is, in fact, a physical object network
Diva Canto: not unlike the internet
Central Station v87: clock pause
Diva Canto: but, of course, we can't "drop" packets here :-)
Farley Scarborough smiles
John Zhaoying: No ... that would be bad. (grin)
Rissa Maidstone chuckles.
John Zhaoying: But you can _stop_ packets here.
Diva Canto: yes, indeed
John Zhaoying: the lines are the input buffers.
Diva Canto: so there are similarities and differences
John Zhaoying: So in that sense, you can produce 100% QoS on all
connections.
Diva Canto: the model of the internet is a good one to look at, but there
are differences that cannot be ignord
John Zhaoying: In terms of packet retention. Not delivery.
Diva Canto: yes - retention must be 100% :-)
Pebbles Hannya: Unfortunately I need to go, but this has been really interesting.
Thanks Diva, and you too Z.
John Zhaoying: It's really more like an MPLS network. Where you have a fixed
channel architecture.
Austen Scanlan accepted your inventory offer.
Diva Canto: let me know if you have more questions about this, Feel free to email me or call me
Diva Canto: lopes@ics.uci.edu
Diva Canto: http://www.ics.uci.edu/~lopes

Introducing SLBrowser
Diva Canto: I have another cool project to talk about, but I'm not sure we have time?
Farley Scarborough is all ears
Znetlady Isbell: Please go ahead = SLBowser?
Diva Canto: yes, it's a search engine
Post Wylie: shoot, Luke, your faded....
Diva Canto: http://slbrowser.com
Csven Concord: Out of curiousity, why SL instead of... for example... a game engine (where the physics would allow lower level investigation)?
Diva Canto: @Csven
Diva Canto: that was because I wanted to find out if SL could be used for these kinds of things
Diva Canto: the immersion factor is a great thing to have
Csven Concord: Makes sense.
Diva Canto: so I wanted to find the limits of a tool like SL
Diva Canto: there are limits, of course, and not all modeling should be done here
Diva Canto: anyway, sens more questions by email. let me talk a bit about my bots :-)
Diva Canto: slbrowser is a search engine like google
Diva Canto: it works like this: we have 14 bots that crawl the grid twice a week
Diva Canto: right now they look like snowmen :-)
Diva Canto: they go around looking for objects on sale
Diva Canto: and we store that information on a server outside.
Diva Canto: We then index it and serve search.
Diva Canto: the indexing has some notion of relevance
Diva Canto: we use an relevance method that is quite unique
Diva Canto: since the bots can see who created the objects inworld, we then compute the statistics of who are the main builders of SL
Diva Canto: there's about 50,000 people who have built SL, essentially
Znetlady Isbell: ah - the 1% rule.
Diva Canto: :-)
Diva Canto: so then we crawl Linden Lab's web pages and scrape the Top Picks of thode 50,000 people
Diva Canto: then we use that to boost those places and their products
Diva Canto: so it's a recommendation-based relevance, where we choose the recommenders very carefully
John Zhaoying: There's a level, though ...
John Zhaoying: ... at which, at first blush, you'd think corporations in SL would _fear_ that.
Znetlady Ibell: lol
John Zhaoying: That's a hard system to game, right?
Csven Concord: And you haven't had the kind of *polite* feedback which other search engines received?
Diva Canto: yes, very hard
Diva Canto: hard to game
Diva Canto: oh...
Diva Canto: actually, the amount of complaints has been really really low
John Zhaoying: But in another sense, they shouldn't. Because (I guess) the search would inevitably be weighted heavily to the picks of the most prolific builders, all of whom are metaverse developers, mostly in the employ (direct or indirect) of corporations.
Diva Canto: some people have contacted me, sometimes very annoyed. I simply do whatever they want
Diva Canto: if they want me to delist their products, I do that in a couple of hours
Diva Canto: so, it has been a relatively smooth ride
Znetlady Isbell: so, basically though it is weighted against a newcomer or less frequent builder?
Brander Heron: What's the rationale for a delist?
Diva Canto: yes
Diva Canto: only if people ask to be delisted
Brander Heron: What reason do they provide, I mean?
Diva Canto: oh, they have all sorts of fears
Csven Concord: What about the freebies? They're sometimes everywhere.
Rissa Maidstone: Diva, Znetlady, thank you, this has been great. Must go get ready for our noon event with the Sci-Fi Writer coming in.
Diva Canto: some people think that our bots are copybots
Diva Canto: other have fears about other people stealing their texture
Csven Concord: (which they might have stolen)
Znetlady Isbell: lol
Brander Heron: Indeed.
Znetlady Isbell: Where can we get the HUD?
Znetlady Isbell: Is it all over SL?
Diva Canto: oh, there's a HUD-giver downstairs near the other guideway
Diva Canto: but you can also use it on a web browser AND...
Diva Canto: you can hook it up to the search window in the SL viewer!
Diva Canto: Here, if you;re interested: http://metaverseinik.com/OpenSearch
Diva Canto: it's really great to be able to use 2 search engines in world
Brandon Catteneo: Link didn't work
Diva Canto: oh sorry
Diva Canto: http://metaverseink.com/OpenSearch
Brandon Catteneo: OK, got it ty :)
Znetlady Isbell: Has LL had any input on the SE?
Diva Canto: well....
Diva Canto: yes and no
Diva Canto: they know about it very well
Diva Canto: but officially they ignore it, because they don't really know what to do of it :-)
Znetlady Isbell: :-)
Diva Canto: we don't make waves eithers
Brandon Catteneo: I think they are realistic about this platform becoming more and more open
Diva Canto: so far, we've been focusing on figuring out how to do google-like search in virtual worlds
Csven Concord: How will you deal with Hetgrid?
Diva Canto: our search technology will scale to OpenSims
Znetlady Isbell: It does not search groups - only locations and objects, right?
Diva Canto: right -- we stay away from Linden Lab's person-related DBs
Znetlady Isbell: of course..
Brandon Catteneo: Is it able to crawl 100% of the Grid?
Diva Canto: it doesn't go into protected sims
Brandon Catteneo: (other than closed sims)
Diva Canto: but other than that, the bots go everywhere
Diva Canto: about 13,000
Diva Canto: bots are really fun
Brandon Catteneo: I mean, has it been successful in doing so wiht lag and all?
Diva Canto: yep
Brandon Catteneo: Cool
Diva Canto: I mean, there are failures here and there
Diva Canto: but overall, it collects most of the information
Diva Canto: it's not 100% deterministic, but it works relaly well
Znetlady Isbell: We should probably wrap up.
Diva Canto: yep -- I need to go to a class
Znetlady Isbell: Thanks so much, Diva!
Brandon Catteneo: The reason I ask is that more lag may cause lower results, so some vendors would be disadvantaged unless they get their stuff out of laggy sims
Diva Canto: thank you for inviting me!
Znetlady Isbell: This has been fascinating.
iAlja Writer: thanks Diva, very informative!
Brandon Catteneo: OK, Diva, thanks a lot
Butch Dae: Thanks.
IYan Writer: this was very interesting, thank you Diva
Znetlady Isbell: I will follow up with Unimodal and perhaps we can have them come into SL a well.
Diva Canto: thank you all. Feel free to contact me
Csven Concord: Enjoyed this. Thanks. Appreciate your time, Diva.
Farley Scarborough: Yes, thanks so much.
Post Wylie: Thanks, Diva.....well done!
Znetlady: Thanks, everyone.
Diva Canto: bye all!

February 5, 2008

SL Business Communicators Meeting: SkyTran Tour Feb 1

Join us for a tour of SkyTran in Second Life, the simulation prototype of a futuritic, but real computer-controlled personalized transportation system that will move riders in two-person pods above the traffic-challenged freeways of California.  Crista Lopes, associate professor of informatics at University of California, Irvine will host us for a tour and discussion of her project on Friday, Feb. 1 at 9:00 a.m. SLT. 

Professor Lopes is using Second Life to test the software that will prevent the magnetically-levitated vehicles from colliding as they merge on and off the overhead roadway. She also hopes to build and test in Second Life the networking system that will allow passengers to direct the pods to a specific location as the project progresses.

Come and see the transportation simulation and learn how Second Life is allowing feedback to engineers and urban planners on the real world design.  The real world project is being built by Unimodal.

In addition to her work on SkyTran, Professor Lopes is the creator of web-based SL search engine and HUD, SLBrowser.  She'll also give us some insights into the search engine she developed for SL, which is being launched commerically by the technology incubator associated with the Unversity of California, Irvine, Tech Coast Works.  You can read a bit more on the SLBrowser and the incubator in this Orange County Register article.

Get a sneak peak at this new transportation system, learn about the SLBrowser, meet Professor Lopes and and bring your questions.

Reserve a spot and to get a landmark, IM Znetlady Isbell in-world or email me. 

Meeting Transcript: SL Business Communicators Meeting Dec 7 with Orange

SL Business Communictors and members of the Orange group were hosted by international telecom company, Orange on their Second Life sim.  With light snow falling, Stephane Adamiak (aka Sarn Aska) of Orange's gaming division, dialed us into the Orange SL project.  Stephane gave us an overview of how it came together inside Orange.  Adri of Metaversatility, metaverse developer for Orange, weighed in a bit on how they translated the brand into 3D representations. 

Great insights - and we thank Orange and Metaversatility for being so generous to share their experience with SL Business Communicators and the community at large.

I'll be following up with Adri on the topic of translating branding into 3D spaces next week and will post more on that shortly.

The transcript of the meeting follows.

Introduction to Orange's SL initiatve:

[9:04]  Znetlady Isbell: Hello, Everyone!!!
[9:04]  Znetlady Isbell: As you get settled, I'm going to just
[9:04]  Znetlady Isbell: give a little introduction and a suggestion for running the meeting today.
[9:05]  Znetlady Isbell: First, welcome and thanks for coming over to Orange.
[9:05]  Sarn Aska: Greetings, everybody !
[9:05]  Znetlady Isbell: And a big thank you to Sarn Aska of Orange and Adri of Metaversalitity for
[9:05]  Znetlady Isbell: being so gracious to meet with us.
[9:06]  Znetlady Isbell: And for hosting us here - snow and all!
[9:06]  Sarn Aska: It's a pleasure.
[9:06]  Adri Saarinen: We're happy to have you, and honored to speak to the group.
[9:06]  Sarn Aska nods.
[9:06]  Znetlady Isbell: Sarn is with the gaming unit or Orange, business development.
[9:07]  Znetlady Isbell: He was instrumental in doing the internal legwork
[9:07]  Znetlady Isbell: of bringing Orange into SL.
[9:07]  Znetlady Isbell: He was on the team that sheparded the process internally and...
[9:07]  Znetlady Isbell: headed up the RFP prcess to find the developer...Metaversatility.
[9:08]  Znetlady Isbell: I've asked him to discuss their reasons and strategies and process.
[9:08]  Znetlady Isbell: We will stop often for questions throughout - so we will take your q's in chat...but please wait until we pause for q's to keep it
[9:08]  Znetlady Isbell: from getting too confusing.
[9:09]  Znetlady Isbell: So, with that, I give you Sarn Aska.
[9:09]  Adri Saarinen applauds!
[9:09]  Znetlady Isbell: Sarn, please tell us about Orange in SL!
[9:09]  Sarn Aska bows before the audience
[9:09]  Ima Ideator: clap clap
[9:09]  Sarn Aska: This is a very borad question...
[9:09]  Sarn Aska: All this adventure actually began a bit more than a year ago
[9:10]  Sarn Aska: Some people in Orange asked what was this Second Life craze
[9:10]  Sarn Aska: And it happened that I was asked to study this platform
[9:10]  Fab Outlander: Welcome everybody you re just in time
[9:10]  Sarn Aska: I realesed this study on december 06
[9:11]  Sarn Aska: and a large meeting followed in january 07
[9:11]  Sarn Aska: Many people were involved
[9:11]  Sarn Aska: Content Division, Strategic Marketing, Brand management, R&d, etc
[9:11]  Sarn Aska: All were wondering what to do in SL and if it was meaningful to step in
[9:12]  Sarn Aska: The first reaction was skepticism and people were a bit concerned with all the bad press
[9:12]  Sarn Aska: You know the sex industry, gambling, etc.
[9:12]  Sarn Aska: However, our recommendation was that SL was a spearhead for a something bigger
[9:12]  Sarn Aska: maybe the next big thing
[9:13]  Sarn Aska: And even if this is not the right time to consider it viable for business, we had to step in to learn and experiment
[9:13]  Sarn Aska: To be prepared for the next wave
[9:14]  Sarn Aska: Then, a transverse team was set up in order to define a project which ended up with the RFP you mentioned
[9:14]  Sarn Aska: The greenlight came on may 07 and we selected MV as our developer
[9:14]  Sarn Aska: The island design and development happened during last summer
[9:15]  Znetlady Isbell: So, lets' see if there are any questions?
[9:15]  Znetlady Isbell: Did the idea start with marketing?
[9:15]  Sarn Aska: No. We didn't want to approach SL for a communication coup
[9:16]  Sarn Aska: and we don't have any product to sell here
[9:16]  Andy Evans: Could describe your company's services in RL?
[9:16]  Sarn Aska: Our goals is more to understand the platform and its potential and to experiment with new ways to interact with users who could become customers

Orange's RL services

[9:17]  Sarn Aska: yes !
[9:17]  JfR Beaumont: What is your aproach with contents coming from SL are you interested with partnership with contents producer and broadcaster
[9:17]  Sarn Aska: Orange is what we call an integrated telco
[9:17]  Sarn Aska: menaing that we offer services for internet, mobile and tv over adsl
[9:17]  Sarn Aska: I encourage you to visit <http://Orange.com>Orange.com for more details
[9:17]  Sarn Aska: The company is quite complex
[9:18]  Andy Evans: ty, will do

Will Orange partner with content developers?

[9:18]  Sarn Aska: regarding partnerships
[9:18]  Sarn Aska: Our idea is to develop relationships with people who are invested in SL
[9:18]  Sarn Aska: who look for innovation
[9:18]  Alanagh Recreant makes a note to look for any links between Orange and Africa... on the website :)
[9:19]  Sarn Aska: If we could achieve to build a strong network of developers and innovators, we would be successful
[9:19]  Sarn Aska: We also want to encourage such ventures. people may have ideas but not the right connections or skills
[9:20]  Sarn Aska: Our idea would be to supprot and facilitate such projects
[9:20]  Alanagh Recreant smiles
[9:20]  Cybergrrl Oh waves
[9:20]  Sarn Aska winks to Cyberggrl

Orange's developer choice:

[9:20]  Znetlady Isbell: What was it about Metaversatility that you chose them as your developer?
[9:21]  Sarn Aska: Interesting.
[9:21]  Sarn Aska: It appeared that MV made a strong proposal which matched our sketchy vision
[9:21]  Ludmilia Zapedzki: :)
[9:21]  Basil Wijaya: I think you are on a good way. Building core team in SL is hard but among the first steps to success
[9:21]  Tynan Clary: /waves to neighbor Cybergrrl
[9:21]  Sarn Aska: The team's dediaction and expertise were a key for the decision
[9:22]  Cybergrrl Oh sends good vibes to Tynan
[9:22]  Sarn Aska: Mv also showed their understanding of the whole virtual worlds phenomenon
[9:22]  Znetlady Isbell: Did they help you form your strategies?
[9:23]  Sarn Aska: Sure. I have some experience in SL myseld, but...
[9:23]  Sarn Aska: MV's expertise is incredible
[9:23]  Sarn Aska: Dealing with communities is not easy
[9:23]  Sarn Aska: And SL has a strong established culture
[9:24]  Sarn Aska: We relied on MV to tune our vision
[9:24]  Sarn Aska: I also have to mention that since the beginning...
[9:24]  Sarn Aska: We intenede to come in with a ...
[9:24]  Sarn Aska: very humble and respectful attitude
[9:24]  Sarn Aska: All the stuff accomplished here is amazing and we have to tell it and to support it
[9:25]  Adri Saarinen nods

Orange's community building activities:

[ 9:25]  Znetlady Isbell: Can you talk a little bit about your activities here - you built an island....
[9:25]  Znetlady Isbell: but you have mae a huge commitment to keeping things lively here.
[9:26]  Znetlady Isbell: Can you tell us about the community builidng you are undertaking?
[9:26]  Basil Wijaya: i agree. All these talented 3D designers and scripters and managers did a beautiful jod and continuer
[9:26]  Sarn Aska: more details ?
[9:26]  Sarn Aska: sorry : lag...
[9:26]  Sarn Aska: Sure
[9:27]  Sarn Aska: Building a compelling sim is a challenge but only a beginning
[9:27]  Adri Saarinen: (Thank you, Basil :) )
[9:27]  Sarn Aska: It doesn't make people coming back
[9:27]  Sarn Aska: GOA has some experience in online environments and community management
[9:27]  Sarn Aska: and we quickly understood that...
[9:28]  Sarn Aska: events and relationships are the true values of such environments
[9:28]  Sarn Aska: We're not in World of Warcraft
[9:28]  Nber Medici smiles
[9:28]  Basil Wijaya: heheh
[9:28]  Sarn Aska: It's much more relying on human interactions
[9:29]  Sarn Aska: So events appeared one of the keys
[9:29]  Sarn Aska: and user generated projects is another one
[9:29]  Sarn Aska: However all this requires a lot of work
[9:29]  Sarn Aska: Building a sustainable community is a long term effort
[9:29]  Znetlady Isbell: Indeed!
[9:30]  Sarn Aska: We are happy with our results so far but we know that the road will be a long one
[9:30]  Nber Medici: I have a question.
[9:30]  Sarn Aska: We're here to learn, experiment !
[9:30]  Znetlady Isbell: Go Nber
[9:30]  Nber Medici: Building a community means that you need a common theme or something to tie folks together. What is your theme?
[9:30]  Sarn Aska: And we have our management's support for doing it.
[9:30]  Sarn Aska grins
[9:31]  Sarn Aska: Interesting question, tricky one also
[9:31]  Nber Medici: hehehe
[9:31]  Kay Levasseur: how do you see sl in general benefitting the business community? general public?
[9:31]  Sarn Aska: Orange is a lifestyle brand
[9:31]  Sarn Aska: And it doesn't offer a unique focus
[9:31]  Sarn Aska: We have some values which we may try to translate here
[9:31]  Nber Medici: Yes that makes it very tricky.
[9:32]  Sarn Aska: and we felt first that creativity, collaboration, innovation were some kind of pillars
[9:32]  Basil Wijaya: good
[9:33]  Sarn Aska: So far, we welcome a bunch of partners on Orange island. It's very early stage
[9:33]  Sarn Aska: But this could illustrate our vision
[9:33]  Znetlady Isbell: Why do you think it is worth it for Orange - obviously they have allocated a substantial budget - how will/are you defining success?
[9:33]  Pebbles Hannya: Will you be using this place for internal purposes (meetings, training, etc.) too?
[9:33]  Sarn Aska: We will make announcements early next year reagrding this plan
[9:33]  Nber Medici: Thank you Sarn

Success measurement:

[9:34]  Sarn Aska: regarding success
[9:34]  Sarn Aska: Again, SL is not the web
[9:34]  Sarn Aska: and we have to define and invent the tools to measure success
[9:34]  Sarn Aska: We may include trafic analysis, buzz tracking for example
[9:35]  Burhop Piccard: buzz tracking?
[9:35]  Sarn Aska: but we will add some more
[9:35]  Sarn Aska: Yes, keeping tracks of Orange Sl island on blogs, websites, etc.

Internal use of SL:

[9:36]  Sarn Aska: Regarding interabl usage, it's a very interesting direction
[9:36]  Nber Medici: It is easy to get people to come ONCE... to get them to come back many times is tricky.
[9:36]  Sarn Aska: So far, the platform appears to be too limited or clumsy for a proper usage
[9:36]  Sarn Aska: But again, I feel that SL has great potential. (other platforms too..)
[9:37]  Sarn Aska: We we need to experiment, prototype and learn. And we would like to see the users involved

Convincing Orange internally

[9:37]  Yesterday Demain: Sarn... can you tell us about the efforts it took to convince Orange internally that Second Life was a great learning ground for what might become mainstream in the coming years - and thus maybe part of services Orange might provide to its customers in the future...
[9:37]  Sarn Aska nods
[9:37]  Sarn Aska: Well...
[9:38]  Sarn Aska: We had to make people see beyond the media hype, first
[9:38]  Sarn Aska: to give accurate numbers, to debunk myths and point the true gems hidden behind all this
[9:38]  Sarn Aska: To point out the eco-system
[9:38]  Sarn Aska: how it fits with web evolution
[9:38]  Sarn Aska: how it complements web 2.0
[9:39]  Sarn Aska: But describing all this would require a whole discussion in itself
[9:39]  Sarn Aska: feel free to react
[9:39]  Sarn Aska: Basically, the idea was to draw a long term strategy
[9:40]  Sarn Aska: and I am convinced that virtual worlds will develop tremendously
[9:40]  Sarn Aska: SL is only a beginning.
[9:40]  Sarn Aska: Understanding it is a key for the next generation which could include SL or not
[9:40]  Burhop Piccard: How do you keep momentum going with relatively little traffic (relative to web pages)
[9:40]  Alanagh Recreant ponders how all of those have been so difficult to convince potential corporate partners of...here in Africa... (will look for it in interest)
[9:41]  Sarn Aska: We will ceratinly have to invent some ways to welcome more users, sure
[9:41]  Alanagh Recreant agrees though!
[9:41]  Sarn Aska: This actually one of the first learnings here
[9:41]  Sarn Aska: Scalability is the key
[9:42]  Sarn Aska: And it will be a key point to find the right platform for more commercially orinted usage
[9:42]  Sarn Aska: SL is definitely limited so far
[9:42]  Sarn Aska: But we may come up with some interesting experiments
[9:43]  Sarn Aska: We have a whole R&D department excited with this direction and MV has certainly some ccoll projects

Will Orange use SL for conducting customer business?

[9:43]  Taliesin Silverstar: are you looking into such things as....being able to open an account, pay my bills, change my services, all inside SL?
[9:43]  Sarn Aska: We considered this approach at some point
[9:44]  Sarn Aska: However, Orange is a mainstream brand and SL is not mainstream yet
[9:44]  Sarn Aska: Orange can't afford to fool people
[9:44]  Sarn Aska: And it would also require a much bigger budget
[9:44]  Sarn Aska: Custom client, support staff, billing system, orientation island, etc
[9:45]  Sarn Aska: But business will be part of the equation at some point
[9:45]  Sarn Aska: We just need to understand the users needs
[9:46]  Sarn Aska: for focused services and properly evaluate platforms for a broader service
[9:47]  Sarn Aska: I also have to mention that we're currently investagating emerging virtual worlds
[9:47]  Adri Saarinen: There are lots of virtual worlds platforms out there with a more business logic and workflow (especially distributed workflow) focus than SL. It's important to use the right tool for the right job.
[9:47]  Sarn Aska: and we also have an open source project coming from the R&D
[9:47]  Sarn Aska: The name is SOLIPSIS
[9:48]  Sarn Aska: It's not meant to be commercial, more about experimentation and research
[9:48]  Sarn Aska: I encourage you to google this. Documentation is public
[9:48]  JimmyJet Fossett: Interesting Sarn that you are looking at alt. virtual world offerings. Will check out your stuff.
[9:49]  Sarn Aska: However, I confess that SL is very fascinating because of its plasticity
[9:49]  Sarn Aska: However, big brands tend to prefer more closed environements for more control

Translating the brand into SL:

[9:50]  Znetlady Isbell: Sarn, could we talk a little about how you translated the brand here in SL? Maybe Adri could weight in a little too?
[9:50]  Sarn Aska: It's my point of view, however
[9:50]  Kay Levasseur: It seems that eventually, business is going to want to be where the end consumers are thought
[9:50]  Kay Levasseur: -t
[9:50]  Sarn Aska: Sure, Adri will certainly have interesting stuff to share
[9:51]  Adri Saarinen laughs
[9:51]  Sarn Aska: Especailly regarding our involvement ^^
[9:51]  Adri Saarinen grins at Sarn
[9:51]  Basil Wijaya: Yes Adri, Which virtual plateform do you think have better business logic and workflow than SL?
[9:51]  Adri Saarinen: Basil, I'll be happy to answer that question, but let me address the branding question first
[9:52]  Adri Saarinen: One of the biggest challenges we had in designing and developing the physical (virtual-physical) aspects of Orange Island was translating both the brand values of Orange and the brand style guides and 'look' to a 3d platform
[9:53]  Adri Saarinen: Orange has an exceptional amount of brand recognition in its core countries, as well as throughout most of Europe, and there is a lot of expectation as to what is and is not "Orange"
[9:53]  Natty Foggarty: bye bye evryone !!!
[9:53]  Nick Rhodes: bye Natty :)
[9:54]  Adri Saarinen: we did several concept designs and spent two months just on the pen-and-paper and prototype phase working to develop something that would be both beautiful and functional
[9:54]  Adri Saarinen: Working closely with Orange brand management, we ended up with this design, something natural in a virtual environment, but open and, we hope, inviting social interaction.
[9:55]  Sarn Aska nods
[9:55]  Adri Saarinen: But adapting guides meant for either real life or 2d web applications was difficult-- how much orange-the-color to use, for instance, what type of soundscapes, music, etc
[9:56]  Sarn Aska: Actually, i like the idea of localisation, not only trabslation but adapting to a specific local culture
[9:56]  Adri Saarinen: (we ended up using the icon guide for color, actually! up to 30% orange-the-color)
[9:57]  Adri Saarinen nods to Sarn. "There was also the quesiton of usability and what would translate poperly to SL people, not just the 3d environment"
[9:57]  Sarn Aska: Usability is indeed a key too
[9:58]  Sarn Aska: We didn't want to offer the umpteenth corporate building surrounded by palm trees
[9:58]  Znetlady Isbell: lol
[9:58]  Nber Medici smiles
[9:58]  Sarn Aska smiles. "private joke, here"
[9:58]  Sarn Aska: The MV proposal was striking in that sense
[9:58]  Adri Saarinen shakes her head. No palm trees.
[9:59]  Znetlady Isbell: So, have new 3D "style guides" been developed?
[9:59]  Sarn Aska: Working on landscape, open environment was central. Even e=including seasonal changes as you can see
[9:59]  Znetlady Isbell: multimedia style guides?
[9:59]  Sarn Aska: We will have to collect all the learnings from this experiment and share it with the whole group
[9:59]  Sarn Aska: Sure
[10:00]  Adri Saarinen: I'm not sure we've developed style guides at this point so much as best practices for Orange in SL. Itw ould be up to brand management to develop a style guide, which I'm sure will happen in the future.
[10:00]  Sarn Aska: Absolutely and this project was very refreshing for the brand team
[10:00]  Znetlady Isbell: Shall we wrap up with Basil's question about other vws?

Other VWs for business

[10:00]  Adri Saarinen: Sure, and maybe Sarn can chime in as well.
[10:01]  Basil Wijaya: he
[10:01]  Sarn Aska nods
[10:01]  Znetlady Isbell: Adri, Sarn?
[10:01]  Adri Saarinen: Part of Metaversatility's company mission and goals has always been to be 'versatile' or 'platform agnostic'
[10:01]  Adri Saarinen: My virtual home in in SL, and I spend my time here, but Metaversatility works in <http://There.com> There.com, Multiverse, Qwaq, and even some flash-based worlds
[10:02]  Sarn Aska: Club Penguin ??
[10:02]  Adri Saarinen: While I think that SL is hands down the best platform for reaching the most people in a social situation, or for a community project like Orange
[10:02]  Adri Saarinen: (not yet Club Penguin!)
[10:03]  Adri Saarinen: in terms of closed business collaboration projects, I'd actually recommend Qwaq, which is an API over the open source project Open Croquet
[10:03]  JimmyJet Fossett: Right, and we saw where Coke will form a presence on There
[10:03]  Adri Saarinen: lots of aspects go into making decisions like that: can you run the platform behind a corporate firewall, does it import standard models if a client already has 3d assets, are you trying to reach a youth markert, etc
[10:03]  Adri Saarinen nods.
[10:04]  Sarn Aska: Sun projects for business sound promising too
[10:04]  Adri Saarinen: I haven't read the Coke announcement so I'm not sure how much I can say, but they are moving their virtual thirst world to <http://There.com>There.com
[10:04]  Ima Ideator: will they still be in SL?
[10:04]  Sarn Aska: Doppelganger's platform looks cool for teens, also
[10:04]  Adri Saarinen: There are also grassroots projects like OpenSim, which allows the SL client to connect to other servers
[10:05]  Adri Saarinen: Yes, Doppelganger runs the Lounge and also the licensed world, Tyra Banks Studio
[10:05]  Sarn Aska: And I'm very interested by Metaplace, even it's more game oriented first
[10:05]  Adri Saarinen: there's a lot of growth in this market, and we, MV, do a lot of evaluating of new and emerging platforms, as Iknow Orange does as well
[10:06]  Adri Saarinen grins at Sarn. "WE'll have to talk more about metaplace later."
[10:06]  Znetlady Isbell: :-)
[10:06]  Sarn Aska winks
[10:06]  JimmyJet Fossett: Hmmm, I think I would like to hear any discussion of Metaplace :-)
[10:06]  Basil Wijaya: Do I understand that Orange explore and build in all these places or only here.
[10:07]  Adri Saarinen: JimmyJet, I think RAph would put a hit out on me if I said anything publicly
[10:07]  Sarn Aska: Only here so far. It's very demanding, you know ^^
[10:07]  Znetlady Isbell: LOL
[10:07]  Basil Wijaya: yes

Wrapping up - and more info on Orange in SL

[10:07]  Znetlady Isbell: Well, we have run up against our one hour time frame.
[10:07]  Basil Wijaya: what about SOLIPSIS
[10:08]  Kay Levasseur: thank you for the information!
[10:08]  Znetlady Isbell: Let's thank Sarn and Adri and Orange for their time, and for hosting us!!
[10:08]  Znetlady Isbell: Thank you!!
[10:08]  Alanagh Recreant claps
[10:08]  Ima Ideator: Ty Sam and Adri!
[10:08]  Yesterday Demain: Thank you for very interesting views...
[10:08]  Basil Wijaya: thanks a lot
[10:08]  Nick Rhodes claps
[10:08]  Maryrose Mariani: Thank You Sarn and Adri
[10:08]  Znetlady Isbell: You may stay and socialize of course....
[10:08]  JimmyJet Fossett: Thanks Sarn and Znet
[10:08]  Alanagh Recreant: thank you very much....
[10:08]  Sarn Aska bows again. "Thanks a lot. I hope that it was worth the teleport"
[10:09]  Adri Saarinen can stay for a bit longer to answer questions. "Also, Orange Island has a permanent staff, our wonderful Orange coaches, Fab Outlander and Moe Anderton, as well as a virtual worlds community manager, Fandango Milena."
[10:09]  Pebbles Hannya: Thanks -- this has been interesting as always :)
[10:09]  Znetlady Isbell: It was very interesting!!
[10:09]  Adri Saarinen: So the island is staffed from 6am-3pm SLT every week day-- they would be happy to show you around at your convenience.
[10:09]  Sarn Aska: Thank you, Znet !
[10:09]  Znetlady Isbell: There is always lots of Orange people around...
[10:09]  Znetlady Isbell: Thank you So much Sarn!!!
[10:09]  Fandango Milena salutes everyone.
[10:10]  Yesterday Demain: Time to go skating on the thin ice of modern life...
[10:10]  Znetlady Isbell: Fandango can help you to other areas of the island if you want to check it out.
[10:10]  Basil Wijaya: I'll visit the island. Although it is Orange, I love the blue trees. Au revoir.
[10:10]  Alanagh Recreant: thanks for inviting me Movies!
[10:10]  Yesterday Demain: We have a great skating rink
[10:10]  Fandango Milena: I can indeed!
[10:10]  Adri Saarinen: if you'd like to keep up to date with Orange events and community announcements, I've put a group/reminder invite sign up behind Znetlady :)
[10:10]  Znetlady Isbell: Enjoy the snow and the skating!
[10:10]  Znetlady Isbell: Yes, join the group!!!!
[10:10]  Fab Outlander: If anybody need ice skating shoes, let me know!
[10:11]  Znetlady Isbell: Thaks Adri...
[10:11]  Adri Saarinen: And you can check out the Orange Island blog

December 7, 2007

Meeting with French Telecom, Orange Friday Dec. 7: SL Business Communicators

Come and join us Friday, December 7 at Orange!  We will be meeting with Stephane Adamiak (aka Sam Aska) with the business development division of French Telecom giant, Orange.   Mr. Adamiak spearheaded the internal research evaluating Second Life (and virtual worlds) as a strategy for Orange, He was instrumental in setting the project goals and concepts and running the RFP process to choose their SL developer, Metaversatility.  Stephane  tells me that their commitment to virtual worlds is not limited to SL, as they consider it a platform for a "potentially major trend for the next decade."

Orange has been exceptionally busy in Second Life since their virtual launch several weeks ago, making a commitment to active community building. You can find something happening there almost all the time from classes to concerts to meetups - all part of Orange's commitment toward that effort.  An editorial comment here, I must say Orange's launch event was one of the top-five best-run events I've attended in SL- largely due to the "social" savvy evident everywhere.

Stephane has been a major player in the corporate strategy for Orange's virtual presence.  Come with questions in hand and learn the what, how and why of Orange in SL. 

What:  SLBC Meeting with Orange
When:  Friday, Dec 7, 9:00 a.m. SLT
Location:  Orange Island, Slurl:  http://slurl.com/secondlife/Orange%201/194/133/31

See you there!  Questions?  IM Znetlady Isbell or email me!

SL Business Communicators Transcript: The Office in SL with Clear Ink

Kiwini Oe (aka Steve Nelson, EVP, Chief Strategy Officer) of Clear Ink is a great typist!  And beyond that, he is funny, incredibly interesting and opened up a view for us into Clear Ink's production of their machinima segments and "back lot production" for NBC's The Office episode, Local Ad which aired October 25. 

Kiwini shared what NBC hired them to do, how the process went and what lessons were learned.  He also illustrated out how quickly and unexpectedly a community can form.  One lesson - always be prepared for what to do next.

The chat transcript follows below.  The SL voice versus chat issue always rears it's head these days. Reporter Draxtor of Life4U was there needing video and audio, but the chat transcripts are so valuable for our purposes. As a compromise, Draxtor will interview Kiwini further this week and that interview will be up on Draxtor's channel on YouTube next week.

A huge thank you to Kiwini for joining us and taking our many questions in stride. Thanks to Pebbles Hannya of Market Truths for hosting us once again - and for capturing the transcript as my machine kept crashing.  Thanks to everyone who came to the meeting!...now on to the interesting conversation:

Znetlady Isbell: Everyone, I will introduce Kiwini Oe of Clear Ink.
Znetlady Isbell: He has some fun stuff to share with us today.
Znetlady Isbell: He's going to talk about his project on The Office for NBC - and lessons learned as well.
Znetlady Isbell: It is informal - text chat for transcript purposes.
Znetlady Isbell: Please ask questions.
Znetlady Isbell: And, unless it gets unruly, should we just use chat for q's Kiwini?
Kiwini Oe: that's OK by me
Znetlady Isbell: Great. Thanks sooo much for being here, Kiwini and everyone.
Znetlady Isbell: I'll turn it over to the guy we came here to hear!
Znetlady Isbell: Kiwini..
Znetlady Isbell: all yours.
Kiwini Oe: Thanks, Z
Kiwini Oe: These will be mostly off-the-cuff recollections
Kiwini Oe: and my colleague, Keystone Bouchard is here as well in case I need my memory refreshed
Kiwini Oe: Clear Ink has been doing work in SL for about a year and a half
Kiwini Oe: though we usually take on about one project at a time
Kiwini Oe: the one I'm talking about today was one we did this Sept-Oct over a very short timeframe
Kiwini Oe: we were in the middle of another project - about a week away from an event
Kiwini Oe: with Newt Gingrich at Second Life Capitol Hill
Kiwini Oe: which was pretty time consuming in and of itself
Kiwini Oe: when I got a call from Kent Zbornak, co-executive producer of "The Office' ON NBC
Kiwini Oe: They had a script that included some of their characters getting into Second Life
Kiwini Oe: and could we help
Kiwini Oe: After thinking about a half second
Znetlady Isbell: lol
Kiwini Oe: We jumped into that one. He said it would be a very tight deadline, so we started working on it as soon as I hung up
Kiwini Oe: It was an interesting process -
Kiwini Oe: We never really signed a contract with them - they signed one with us about a week later
Kiwini Oe: but as soon as we hung up, they mailed us a script, and digital photos they took on the spot
Kiwini Oe: of Rainn Wilson and John Krasinski
Kiwini Oe: so that we could start on avatars
Znetlady Isbell: fun!
Kiwini Oe: The script looked good - it was written by BJ Novak
Kiwini Oe: who plays Ryan the temp who turned into Ryan the executive
Kiwini Oe: So we started right away on the avatars, and also spent the weekend location scouting
Kiwini Oe: Kent said basically, "run with this" - saying they were trusting us to do what was right in Second Life.
Goldie Goodman: Nice to have a client like that!
Kiwini Oe: That was the main directive from the get-go, and that was an important thing for him to tell us, and for us to recognize.
Pebbles Hannya: You might want to answer this later, but did they know that SL avatars don't usually look like the RL people? It seems like almost the only ones that do are people who come in for TV things. I wonder if that's a deliberate decision or lack of understanding of SL?
Znetlady Isbell: or branding? heheeh
Kiwini Oe: The script called for Dwight to make an avatar that was *exactly* like himself because he liked his first life so much
Pebbles Hannya: Yes, true about the branding
Kiwini Oe: he wanted his second one to be just like it
Znetlady Isbell: ah- so true..
Kim Chihuly: did you have a connection with them from some earlier project? How had they heard of you?
Kiwini Oe: We looked at the script for locations, and Kent said to send over shots based on the script, or based on any other locations that would be familiar
Kiwini Oe: Good question, Kim -
Kiwini Oe: I had thought it was a direct reference from Linden Lab
Kiwini Oe: but I think they gave NBC a list of who might be able to do this
Kiwini Oe: and given the quick turn
Kiwini Oe: we were available
Goldie Goodman: how quick?
Kim Chihuly: thanks
Kiwini Oe: Well, we got the call on Sept 21, and the show was to air Oct 25
Maryrose Mariani: ouch
Robbie Kiama: :)
Robbie Kiama: fast
Goldie Goodman: A whole month??? lol
Kiwini Oe: But they had to do shooting for the show Oct 1-5
Pebbles Hannya: :)
iAlja Writer: :)
Kiwini Oe: so they put off the shooting of the SL scenes until the last day - Oct 5
Maryrose Mariani: so a couple of weeks barely
Kiwini Oe: right
Kiwini Oe: The first weekend was location scouting and avatar creation
Goldie Goodman: What were your criteria for locations?
Kiwini Oe: Then that week we narrowed down the locations and did snapshot storyboards
Kiwini Oe: We needed locations that mapped to the script, that would be recognizable in SL
Kiwini Oe: and that were practical for filming - low lag, etc
Goldie Goodman: That last one is always a concern.
Kim Chihuly: recognizable - to whom? SL users or ??
Kiwini Oe: They had one scene scripted as "downtown urban"
Kiwini Oe: recognizable to SL users
Kiwini Oe: I did my location shots at the "Downtown" sim - and the producers really liked it
Kiwini Oe: When I went back for a test shoot - "Downtown" was gone!
Znetlady Isbell: ah!
Kiwini Oe: I IMed the owner, who said it had just closed
iAlja Writer: ouch
IYan Writer: whoops
Goldie Goodman: Yikes
Kim Chihuly: aarrgh!
Maryrose Mariani: lol
Kiwini Oe: so we went over to Amsterdam, which worked great
Maryrose Mariani: truly an sl moment
Goldie Goodman: What type of permission did you have to get from the sim owners?
Kiwini Oe: There was a scene in a nightclub where Dwight plays his recorder
Kiwini Oe: So I talked to Ham Rambler and Sitearm Madonna at the Blarney Stone in Dublin
Kiwini Oe: and we filmed a scene there
Kiwini Oe: There was a paintball scene - we actually filmed a test at Paintball Funhouse - but the producers had something more specific in their heads, so Keystone built one
Kiwini Oe: We went to Boardman to film Dwight just walking down the streeet
Kiwini Oe: That was in the first still shot that NBC put on their web site
Kiwini Oe: and people immediately started commenting on blogs that they recognized it.
Robbie Kiama: cool
Kiwini Oe: So we ended up with 8 locations for shooting, and we did most of the shooting on Oct 2
Kiwini Oe: Tuesday bef